Albino Western Venomoid

"I doubt you even know what the process of "de-venoming" a snake is. Take a look at this link and please tell me its humane?"

Now now, just because I ask for references doesn't make me a moron. And, just because I ask for references doesn't make me a pro -moider. The link to the surgery in process, I would say it's inhumane. Not because it's a red neck visual aid, it would be due to the fact of animal's pain discomfort. After all, one hard surface (Block) is just as good as another (Steel table); One restraint method (Bands) is just as good as another (straps). I am of course assuming the mandible wasn't ripped apart from the maxilla and they are claiming the animal eats and is still alive so I'm 'sure' that didn't happen. According to this site only Betadine was used while the whole process would have medically involved little or more of Lidocaine, Zolazepam, soflurane, Midolazam, Diazepam, Buprenorphine, and other analgesic and 'whatever' drugs. That there would determine my answer.

""Now show me some scientific data that venomoids live past a normal venomous snake life expectancy.""

If I could, I would. Actual venomoids haven't been around long enough to determine long post assumptions. However, it is a wide practice of feeding prekilled prey items to hots, in which case would help factor the venom digesting into not being a highly debated issue. Venom needs the aid of blood flow to do what venom does. A dead animal has no blood flow there for no wide functioning of the venom. Also, most hots that feed on prekilled animals don't even inject it's toxins into the animal to begin with.. I mean, you don't have to take my word for it. Dr. Bryan Fry's exact words are

"I have personally witnessed snakes that were devenomised young that had no growth differences. In any case, most captive hots are fed dead prey and many of the lazy little bastards don't even bother to envenomate anymore, just sucking the prey down! Obviously they are not useing their venom for pre-digestion in such cases.
Take care
B" (Feel free to contact him on this.)
-Can you show me exact evidence in where -moids do not?
I do not doubt the venom's capability of aiding in digestion, I just doubt that it's an absolute necessity and that it's that much of a life expectant determination. I mean, is one snake's digestive system that much weaker than another of same average build?

""Show me some data in a case which ripping out and slaughtering an animal because of its selfish owners enjoyment to handle a venomoid, actualy helped the snake in the longrun.""

Eh, you do realize most seller's that take part in -moiding their hots really do not care to handle them. I figured this would be the part where you preached about money grubbing' or something. Which would be something I would agree with you on without protest. By the way, you know not all snakes are immune to self inflicted bites, right? I do believe there is or was a pic, of a snake that died after biting itself on here somewhere. That could prove in favor.. heh..

""You cannot provide this information because any good herper,scientist, or hobbyist will tell you its wrong. ""

Right..

"Nevermind" -- I wasn't expecting you to feel bad, but I was expecting someone to comment exactly the way you did. It figures there is always some moron on these forums that has nothing to say but call someone a "tree hugger" or "dirt worshipper". I don't care about the preservation of a rainforest nor do I care about the meat that I eat, but the fact of the matter is that cows,pigs or whatever animal is slaughterd,killed, and butchered for food is done reasonably. Excuse me for caring about an animal, and animal that you more then likely keep if your browsing these forums which you must care for? You are a very contradictive idiot and please refrain from responding with your "hippy" crap.
___________

Reptile-- owning a venomoid isn't bad if its a rescue, but participating in the de-venoming is horrible. Like I said the snake is amazing itself, but I don't really all support the ripping out of venom glands and stripping it of its reason to live. There are probably alot of sides to this story and plenty of people to comment on that.

You both have extremely valid arguements and alot of evidence to back your points.
There is one thing though that I dont understand, Isnt the point of keeping a venomous snake because it is venomous? Why keep a venomous snake that has no venom, It kind of defeats the purpose doesnt it? Its kind of like saying "I have the most venomous snake in the world....Oh yeah but its not venomous". There are some acceptions but not many. So why not just get a non-venomous snake to begin with and save us and the snake all the trouble.

shuba- animals killed for food arent killed reasonably at all they are kept in tiny crowded quarters to restrict movement to make them extra tasty then alot have there throats sliced to bleed them. if your gonna feel bad for one feel bad for all .and i dont love my animals i love my kid herps are just a hobby i enjoy.

and blue tonge- one reason for having a venemoid could be practice before getting a hot so you dont get killed, or cause you got kids or even if you just want a damn trophy animal who cares

Indeed Blue Tongue. Though there are a limited of very decent propsals for keeping venomous snakes, there really is no reason for any common, everyday, average keeper to have one. Plus it's redicules to spend 3 times the amount on a snake that has been broken. I wouldn't pay more for anything else that's been broken, I won't start here.

""i dont love my animals i love my kid herps are just a hobby i enjoy.""

Though true to many keepers, I find this kind of saddening..

""one reason for having a venemoid could be practice before getting a hot so you dont get killed""

If you're going to practice on a snake that isn't venomous, save your money and buy a non venomous snake. They will both present the same amount of tention; Knowing your animal isn't venomous just promotes a lack of control. You should be trained if you're looking for practice, which is recommended.

""or cause you got kids""

Get off your lazy ass and house the animals properly. The whole "Because I have a family" excuse is tiresome, over done and downright retarded. It's because you're lazy or lack the proper equipment to keep them. It's ok to tell the truth, no one cares if you can't or dont want to keep hots..

""if you just want a damn trophy animal who cares""


I do.

I just don't understand the keeping of venomoids, if u want a snake without its venom, get something non-venomous. If its just to impress your friends, you shouldn't be keeping any animals for that reason, period. If you just want to hold the animal, again, get something that isn't venomous, with that reason your obviously only thinking of urself, so u would be happy to know a corn snake that u can hold is much cheaper than venomoiding a poor rattlesnake for ur amusement.


"nevermind", u extremely irritate me, to put it lighlty. Quit reffering back to un humanely killed cows, this discussion is about VENOMOIDS, not some cow that got killed. If u can't even have a decent discussion about this subject, the OBVIOUSLY u shouldn't be arguing about it!!!!


The "excuse" to keep venomoids because u want to keeping hots in the future and need the practice is just plain freaking stupid. Venomoid snakes have had their darn heads cut open and their glands ripped out, thats causes a lot of stress, so the snake after the venomoid operation is so stressed and beat up it doesn't even want to move anymore, let alone keep u on ur toes to u practice for the real thing. An Asian ratsnake is more aggressive than any venomoid out there, if u want practice, get a trainer, practice with aggro non-vens, and slowly move to something mildy venomous, and so on. Don't destroy a snake just so u can hold it. What if u were a baby, and teething, and ur mom ripped ur teeth out so u couldn't bite anything else anymore, i'm sure u wouldn't like that well at all.

"ReptileFreak" and "irwin" its nice their are people that can give respectable responses and I can agree to most things you say. "nevermind" did you notice no one agreed with you, thats becuase your a Dick. Suck my balls

lol, that's great.

im obviously not gonna get any points across so whatever just please dont compare people to animals . they are not people they are animals im sorry i dont love them like i love my kids

Nevermind - Your comparing apples to oranges. There is no comparison to mammalian alterations. The killing of livestock SERVES A PURPOSE. Taking a venomous snakes glands doesn't serve a purpose but filling ones desire to handle a hot and is quite selfish if you ask me. If you need to practice, use snakes that are naturaly aggressive and not venomous. That is a bad excuse "they want to practice". Please come up with something more then that.

all of this is OPINION and i dont know why i bothered tryin to change any bodys opinion (just bored i guess) cause i know nobodys changing my opinions.i dont care about venomoids but obviously some people do, so ill stop arguing cause i really dont care, good luck with your animals

It's actually true cause the hemotoxins in a rattlesnaje destroy the red blood cells.

I dont agree with venomoids but I'm not gonna worry myself about it cause I know that people are gonna do it. Very attractive snake and setups, I can tell you are a responsible guy(besides agreeing with venomoids)

This made me laugh so hard ..........."please dont compare people to animals . they are not people they are animals" Haha people are animals retard!! People are similar to mammals in many ways, to birds in some ways and to reptiles in a few ways. In many cases you can relate people to reptiles.

its a great looking snake but why would u want a venomous snake that doesn't have any venom...and whats the point of removing there tails...you should just respect the animals, and leave them the way they were born, this is like down in india most snake charmers remove fangs and teeth off of cobras and pythons by shoving large sticks in there moves and movin it in and out to break the teeth off the snake. animals feel the same pain that every thing feels, it just like asking a dentist to remove your teeth with a nife, and dont freeze it, the nasking the doctor to remove ur toncils without anisthetic. It would fuckin hurt, thats just like the venomiods it would hurt alot plus most of the time they straped so they cant move. The reptiles were here before we were so we should at least respect them by leaving there bodys the way they are................and nevermind fuck u....u take it u pthe ass for nikels.........anyway it is a good looking snake but i dont support venomiods anyways. but i like the enclosures in the back.

i was gonna let this go but you crybaby P.E.T.A. types keep calling me out . every venemoid ive seen on this sight looks perfectly healthy ,its no different than declawing a cat . i didnt even want a venemoid before this conversation but now i want one and ill do my best to encourage everyone i know to get one. so keep letting out your pussycalls maybee someone will hear them

Crybaby? your the one flippin out. I was just voicing my opinion very respectably and pointing out your borderline retarded arguments.