Hawk eating
by Matty013
Feb 23, 2004 6:32 PM · 1572 views · 70.2 k · 640 x 480
Comments (13)
hawkman99
Feb 25, 2004 3:20 PM
Rating: 5/5
nice pic, how close did you get to him? btw, that is a north american goshawk
Matty013
Feb 28, 2004 1:38 AM
I actually took the picture from inside the house. He was about 15 feet away. I have no idea what kind of hawk it was.
Ravenspirit
Mar 17, 2004 12:21 AM
Rating: 5/5
Nice picture - hes either a Male Coopers Hawk, or a Male sharp shin - Im pretty sure a coopers.
hawkman99
Mar 17, 2004 8:27 PM
are you sure? a sharpie is smaller than a coops, and most coopers are brown and white with streaks, and have more of a square head. This one looks like grey like a goshawk. but I have been known to be wrong.
Saker
Mar 20, 2004 11:24 PM
Rating: 5/5
this is not a coopers hawk and definitely not a sharp shin. Only thing left is a gos :)
hawkman99
Mar 23, 2004 7:42 PM
Thanks saker ( tips hat) I did not want to come off like a know it all, but I am a falconer, and know a few people that fly goshawks. a name like saker, are you a falconer?
Ravenspirit
Mar 25, 2004 5:20 PM
Ill just say, if hes a gos, why does he have the orange cream banding on his breast....
Gos hawks also have a different colored head then this guy. Hen sharpies, and coopers are brown and strip-E, the adult males are the handsome slaty blue this guy is.
Check this out for pictures, and note the breast and head -
Coopers -
http://www.buteo.com/cooper.html
http://www.mbr-pwrc.usgs.gov/Infocenter/i3330id.html
http://www.ronausting.com/cooper's.htm
(mostly hens)
Northern Goshawk -
http://www.ronausting.com/goshawk.htm
(see the stripe on the head I am speaking of ?)
I do all sorts of birds, and that isnt a goshawk -
Gos hawks also have a different colored head then this guy. Hen sharpies, and coopers are brown and strip-E, the adult males are the handsome slaty blue this guy is.
Check this out for pictures, and note the breast and head -
Coopers -
http://www.buteo.com/cooper.html
http://www.mbr-pwrc.usgs.gov/Infocenter/i3330id.html
http://www.ronausting.com/cooper's.htm
(mostly hens)
Northern Goshawk -
http://www.ronausting.com/goshawk.htm
(see the stripe on the head I am speaking of ?)
I do all sorts of birds, and that isnt a goshawk -
hawkman99
Mar 25, 2004 9:31 PM
Ravenspirit,
this is a friendly debate I hope. At least it is on my end:}
look at the tarsus (shin bone) in this pic then look at the one in the link that you provided for the coops http://www.mbr-pwrc.usgs.gov/Infocenter/i3330id.html
especially the top adult pic. it is very long ang thin. now look at the gos link you provided http://www.ronausting.com/goshawk.htm
look at the pic of the gos flying. its feathers cover more of the leg than the coops, which leads me to believe it is a gos. let me know what you think.
this is a friendly debate I hope. At least it is on my end:}
look at the tarsus (shin bone) in this pic then look at the one in the link that you provided for the coops http://www.mbr-pwrc.usgs.gov/Infocenter/i3330id.html
especially the top adult pic. it is very long ang thin. now look at the gos link you provided http://www.ronausting.com/goshawk.htm
look at the pic of the gos flying. its feathers cover more of the leg than the coops, which leads me to believe it is a gos. let me know what you think.
Ravenspirit
Mar 25, 2004 10:38 PM
It is indeed a friendly debate- :>
I think what you are seeing is because his legs are tilted forward into the prey. Look at the gos pic next to this one, and the coppers pic next to this one at the same time.
The coloring of the breast, and of the head leave me no doubt that this is certianly not a goshawk.
IMO, Goshawks look more like a beuto, and less like an accipiter, when they are on the ground.
Raven -
I think what you are seeing is because his legs are tilted forward into the prey. Look at the gos pic next to this one, and the coppers pic next to this one at the same time.
The coloring of the breast, and of the head leave me no doubt that this is certianly not a goshawk.
IMO, Goshawks look more like a beuto, and less like an accipiter, when they are on the ground.
Raven -
hawkman99
Mar 25, 2004 11:55 PM
(your quote)"I think what you are seeing is because his legs are tilted forward into the prey."
If his legs are tilted forward, then he would be sitting on his elbows (can't think of the name of that joint) and would make him look like he was sitting on his tail. wouldn't you think? Also the grass is not that tall, nor is the prey.
If his legs are tilted forward, then he would be sitting on his elbows (can't think of the name of that joint) and would make him look like he was sitting on his tail. wouldn't you think? Also the grass is not that tall, nor is the prey.
Ravenspirit
Mar 26, 2004 4:05 AM
If his legs (or at least the leg facing us) are/is tilted forward into the ruffled prey, like it/they are, he would be sitting on his "ankles". A birds "foot" and "tarsus" are all part of its "foot", and his "knees" are up near his armpits.
While I do not think he is "sitting" on that joint, he is certianly not in a relaxed position, and does seem to be a bit slouched as the reason I can't posotively ID his as a coopers and not a sharpie.
I have no size comparison, and I can't see the tip of his tail, which is broader on a coopers then a sharpshin, and the tail of a coopers comes to a smooth edge, while a sharpshins tail is more blunt.
The lack of white "eyebrows" over his orbital ridge, (A defining feature of adult goshawks, and this is certianly not a juvenile of any of the three species) alone, is a good enough field mark for positive identification as one of the other 2 north american accipiters.
Judging on a gesstamate on the prey being "mourning dove-ish" in size, And on the bird compared to the grass, thats why Im pretty sure hes a coopers.
Raven -
While I do not think he is "sitting" on that joint, he is certianly not in a relaxed position, and does seem to be a bit slouched as the reason I can't posotively ID his as a coopers and not a sharpie.
I have no size comparison, and I can't see the tip of his tail, which is broader on a coopers then a sharpshin, and the tail of a coopers comes to a smooth edge, while a sharpshins tail is more blunt.
The lack of white "eyebrows" over his orbital ridge, (A defining feature of adult goshawks, and this is certianly not a juvenile of any of the three species) alone, is a good enough field mark for positive identification as one of the other 2 north american accipiters.
Judging on a gesstamate on the prey being "mourning dove-ish" in size, And on the bird compared to the grass, thats why Im pretty sure hes a coopers.
Raven -
kentobizmol
Sep 29, 2004 10:20 PM
it's probably a sharp-shinned hawk or a goshawk.
it depends on which state he/she took the picture in.
hey Matty103, which state do you live in?
it depends on which state he/she took the picture in.
hey Matty103, which state do you live in?
khorner
Apr 14, 2005 9:32 AM
Rating: 4/5
I am interested in how you ruled out the coop completely kentobizmol (and with no explanation whatsoever, I might add). The state is not gonna tell you anything, cause there is huge range overlap for all three species.
To me, this is definitely not a gos. The lighting is not very good in the pic, but there definitely appears to be reddish barring on the belly. Even if we are uncertain of the colour, the barring is too coarse to be a gos, which should have very fine, grey barring. Also the head markings are completely inconsistant with goshawk, which should show a distinct black bar through the eye, with a black cap and white stripe between. This bird has no eye bar, no white stripe and a cap consistent with the blue body colour.
As for coop versus sharpie, it is very hard to tell, especially with only this picture to work from. The shape and size of the bill and head is one aspect that I would look at, and makes me think coopers. The sharpie has a smaller head and bill, and shorter neck. Still, it is very difficult to tell for sure, easier distinguished in flight.
A note on gender, in contradiction to what was previously stated, male and female coopers and sharpies are almost identical in colouration, with the female usually being slightly larger. Only the gos shows some dimorphism.
Cheers,
Kyle
To me, this is definitely not a gos. The lighting is not very good in the pic, but there definitely appears to be reddish barring on the belly. Even if we are uncertain of the colour, the barring is too coarse to be a gos, which should have very fine, grey barring. Also the head markings are completely inconsistant with goshawk, which should show a distinct black bar through the eye, with a black cap and white stripe between. This bird has no eye bar, no white stripe and a cap consistent with the blue body colour.
As for coop versus sharpie, it is very hard to tell, especially with only this picture to work from. The shape and size of the bill and head is one aspect that I would look at, and makes me think coopers. The sharpie has a smaller head and bill, and shorter neck. Still, it is very difficult to tell for sure, easier distinguished in flight.
A note on gender, in contradiction to what was previously stated, male and female coopers and sharpies are almost identical in colouration, with the female usually being slightly larger. Only the gos shows some dimorphism.
Cheers,
Kyle
